Appraisers' Free Forum

I asked a group of appraisers I know who do not participate in any forum what they thought of the HVCC and the majority of them like it because they are not getting pressure from someone with a stake in it.

Frank, the geographical competency issue has been around since the advent of licensing. I remember distinctly when I started to see appraisers from 50 miles away hit my little berg, and it was right around 1991-92. As a matter of fact, from around 1996 to when I went corporate in 2004, I could no longer call my local appraisers friends regarding FSBO information because they had not appraised it; instead it had been appraised by some appraiser from miles and miles away without a clue on our market. Maybe it is different where you are, but in my market it has been in place since licensing.

Oh, and one thing that I see as a possible consequence of the HVCC and the anger it has stirred in members of NAR (the selling side) is that there may well be a push towards using local lenders again, those that maintain their own appraisal departments. The problem with any appraisal department, be it in an AMC or a bank owned one, is that if the appraisals don't meet sales prices too often, the agents scream until the offending appraiser is removed from their post/panel. I distinctly remember hearing about that back pre-licensing when the Realtors in my area drove the chief appraiser at a local bank out. They refused to take any work to that bank while he was there, and low and behold, somehow he had to resign. Disgusting and pitiful. I've been around this business long enough to remember the days when appraisers were well respected and if a house didn't appraise at sales price, the parties renegotiated or the deal died. I believe licensing, by equalizing appraisers in the lenders eyes, contributed to the whole mess more than just about anything.

Francois K. Gregoire wrote:

Steve Owen wrote:This story, posted by one of our old friends, tells the whole story vis a vis geographic competence. It also puts the lie to the idea that under HVCC the real estate agent cannot have any influence on the choice of appraiser.

http://appraiseractive.blogspot.com/2009/06/competency-wins-one.html

Hey!! I'm not that old.

I just returned from a meeting with NAR folks in Chicago. The HVCC is an extremely hot topic with NAR leadership. There was some concern expressed about how Yun's comment came out, and acknowledgment it did not come out right and gives the wrong impression.

I've got more news, but have to get some work done after two days out of town. The one piece of news I can provide is that Frank Gregoire has been appointed as Vice Chairman of the NAR Appraisal Committee for 2010. I last served as Chairman of the Appraisal Committee in 2002. You can count on the Appraisal Committee being a squeaky wheel for the next two years.

Would in be possible to suggest that NAR encourages/requires an appraisal subcommittee with all local Association/Board of Realtors?

Congratulations, Frank. I know you'll make us proud.

NAR President McMillian said

we need realistic appraisals that are based on proper comparisons and done by a local specialist,”

Jay Trotta wrote:Question...is that a code word for "we want appraisers we can influence"?

I don't think it's a conspiracy Jay...this is the same thing so many appraisers have been complaining about for so long.

I've run into a couple appraisals recently from outfits well north of our locale. Ironic thing is...they're not appraising low...they're appraising VERY high.

Number hitters are still in business.

Inaccurate appraisal can defined as an opinion of value lower than the contract price. The NAR is no better than an organized and licensed group of hookers. My last experience with one of those NAR elitists was when he was at the subject property with the buyer and home inspector, they showed up 10 minutes after I did. He was strutting around like a bantam rooster and thought he was going to put on a show for them. He started in on me and said, "We decided to hold off on the appraisal until after the home inspection came back, what are you doing here?" He was also upset that &$(#( his favorite NAR lap dog approved appraiser wasn't there, he also mumbled something about the HVCC. I decided to dress him down in front of his buyer and home inspector and told him what I was doing was no concern of his and to mind his own business. The broker king blushed 3 shades of red, a moment later I could see the home inspector snickering, apparently no one had ever talked to him like that before. The only thing worse than the NAR whores are NAR "approved" appraisers who lick their shoes for crumbs.

Senior Jefe wrote:Inaccurate appraisal can defined as an opinion of value lower than the contract price. The NAR is no better than an organized and licensed group of hookers. My last experience with one of those NAR elitists was when he was at the subject property with the buyer and home inspector, they showed up 10 minutes after I did. He was strutting around like a bantam rooster and thought he was going to put on a show for them. He started in on me and said, "We decided to hold off on the appraisal until after the home inspection came back, what are you doing here?" He was also upset that &$(#( his favorite NAR lap dog approved appraiser wasn't there, he also mumbled something about the HVCC. I decided to dress him down in front of his buyer and home inspector and told him what I was doing was no concern of his and to mind his own business. The broker king blushed 3 shades of red, a moment later I could see the home inspector snickering, apparently no one had ever talked to him like that before. The only thing worse than the NAR whores are NAR "approved" appraisers who lick their shoes for crumbs.

now THAT is funny

Corporate Lackey wrote:now THAT is funny

Disclaimer: I'M NOT A REALTOR®

And it's not funny.

It's not funny when a "Realtor®" bashes the entire appraisal profession.

It's not funny when an Appraiser bashes the entire lending community.

It's not funny when a Lender bashes the entire home inspection business.

And, it's not funny when a Home Inspector bashes the entire Realtor® organization.

It's little wonder American's can't get to & from work without flipping each other off or shooting each other, and I understand why the rest of the world can't stand America...hell...we hate each other.

People are just at each other throats nowadays, and you just know...it's only going to get worse.

Come on Mako, lighten up.

FTR I am a Realtor and have been for 25-years. I have loads of Realtor friends whom I consider consummate professionals, and have loads of appraiser friends with whom I feel the same way. I have some friends who are loan officers, but we long ago decided it was a very bad idea for me to do any work for them. Senor Jefe was poking fun as far as I could tell. We all know agents who fit that description, as we know appraisers (and whomever) who do as well. It is a human trait, not an agent trait whereby someone acts a pompous ass. We all see it and it is nice when one gets deflated a bit.

We don't all hate each other. I think we as an industry (the entire real estate industry) is in a state of flux and huge stress. It is not pleasant being in this business much of the time and people are very angry because so many folks have lost tons of money and their "investments" in their homes. Heck, we had a house sell in Ann Arbor the other day that sold for $25,000. It is not in a bad area, just on a very busy road. In the 25-years I have been active in this community I haven't seen anything go that low in this area, or much of anywhere (save a couple dissimilar neighborhoods). Appraisers are simply measuring the market and reporting what they see. They are not making the market as NAR is trying to indicate. It is time that all of us start doing some PR with the agents in our local communities so they know what we deal with and that we are not the ones manipulating the market.

Kisses

I am an appraiser and home inspector, the wife is a real estate salesperson. Both are members of NAR. We both have plenty of experience with those types of agents and can appreciate the humor. I have to say that while wearing the inspection hat, I've had occassion to see many other appraisers do their thang. Some, but not the majority, have Jeffe's cajones when instructed by the Man (or Lady). Most are clueless mopes who will sometimes ask me hillariously naive questions about the building.

The clueless mope thing brings up a point. While I stand mainly with the majority here, I have to think there are more than a few occurences of appraiser lowballing. Consider: HVCC has taken much of the business risk away from coming in under contract; while the license risk of overvaluing is perceived to be greater than ever. UW second guessing based on AVMs filled with REO and short sales are typical. Actually appraising stuff can be difficult, particulalry in markets experiencing some flux. The old black book adjustment amounts don't work anymore, like in Lackey's example of the busy-street-house. Reaction to features/defects are magnified. Most of these $200 guys are used to taking the path of least resistance so, heck, why not just lowball the damn thing, get paid, and move on?

Corporate Lackey wrote:Come on Mako, lighten up.

I'll try.

But, trying to "dress down" people in front of their clients ISN'T the best business plan.

Neither is trying to "strut your stuff" around strangers.
Friend of mine used to be married to a pretentious woman who was studying for a degree in psychology. At a local fundraiser for who-knows-what one evening, she was seated with her husband and two other couples. She started lecturing the table about what she'd learned about psychology, and why a couple of other participants were dead wrong about a statement one of them had made. In short, she was strutting around very pretentiously, because she was nearing a "degree in psychology." It ended when one of the ladies who was disagreeing with her answered, "Yes, I know what the book says. What you're talking about is in Chapter 11. But if you finish the book, you'll find that procedure discredited in chapter 20. Oh, and by the way, I wrote the textbook you're studying."

I apologize if my post offended the crusaders, I'll be more considerate in the future.

For the record, I think you did the right thing, Jefe. I might not have been as diplomatic as you, but the results would have been similar.

Senior Jefe wrote:I apologize if my post offended the crusaders, I'll be more considerate in the future.

See...now that's funny.

Jim Plante wrote:Neither is trying to "strut your stuff" around strangers.

We've all got stories Jim. And Jefe's hit me wrong, because I've experienced similar situations myself (who hasn't ).

Sometime ago I had a Home Inspector recommended to me. Unbeknownst to me...the guy was a Realtor® hater. I walked up to him with my client, smiled, stuck out my hand and said, "it's a pleasure to meet you...you come highly recommended" (from a dip-shit). Prick didn't like the way I was dressed, the car I drove, the way I combed my hair, or maybe he just thought I was "strutting my stuff," and he was going to "dress me down in front of my client," but he just grunted at me. I heard from another agent later he'd done the same thing to her.

I called the wife immediately after the introductions, and told her we were going to have problems with Mr. Attitude. Either I'm Nostradumbass, or I could tell from the jerk's attitude he didn't like "Realtors®" (every Agent is a "Realtor" to this kind of idiot), and I could tell he'd made up his mind he was going to #$@& with the deal before the inspection even began.

Business has been slow for this ass, and I don't mind saying I've told my story to numerous agents & brokers, and will until the guy finds a different line of work. But I don't go around bashing the entire home inspection industry or ASHI because, one individual or two is a bad representative.

This is how petty, unnecessary, time wasting fights get started among immature people who never left the sandbox.